I offered and some brave soul took me up on it…a guest blog opportunity for a man to reply to the question of “test-driving your relationships”.
John has been in Single’s Ministry for nearly 2 decades. He wishes you to know he is an Alpha male who truly loves Jesus but doesn’t always get it right. He also wishes you to know he isn’t a writer and not always as delicate at speaking his mind as some would like. But I trust his heart and in 8 years of friendship I’ve never doubted His passion for serving singles nor His crazy, full-on devotion to Christ.
Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you John…
Caution: Danger ahead. Do not proceed if you don’t honestly want to understand how men think. This road isn’t for the faint of heart. Fasten your seatbelts and hold on tight.
I waited to write a guest blog to see if anyone else would. I’m a coward like most other men and didn’t want to be the one to have to explore this but the elephant remains in the middle of the road and we are all trying to drive around it. So here goes.
First, let’s name the elephant. It’s the question everyone is thinking but no one dares ask out loud in print. Why do men Test-Drive women in the first place?
There, that wasn’t so bad. Was it? Now we can get to my second point which is the premise on which everything else I say will be based.
The question rephrased really comes down to why are single men constantly on the look out for the most beautiful woman we can find? There are a number of reasons. Notice I said reasons, not excuses because I am not excusing our behavior. Before I drive into them, here’s the premise I promised.
Men are visual.
Does that shock you? If that makes you angry, blame God. He created men to be visual. Sure women like a good-looking man. But how many times have you seen an average looking guy with a stunning woman compared to the other way around? Maybe the later happens once in a while. If she’s a cougar with a boatload of money. But the average Jack & Jill don’t work that way. So here’s another way of explaining this. Men buy magazines to look at cars and women. Women buy magazines, from Teen to Glamour to look at, you guessed it, other women. So they can painstakingly model the other women. So men will notice them. Because men are VISUAL CREATURES.
Are we clear on the premise? Good. Now about test-driving. Here’s your top 5 reasons men do that.
1. Men have vivid imaginations. We don’t simply notice physical beauty. We like to try it on in our minds. We try to be respectful of the woman we are with. My head has never turned when I’m with my gal and a pretty woman walks by but I’ve had to close my eyes a time or two cos my eyes were rolling to the back of my head to follow her. In a moment of temporary insanity, I pictured myself with the hot babe who just passed by. Why? Because it is an ego boost. For a legit guy in a loving relationship, we will return to our sanity and realize there is no more beautiful woman in God’s universe than the one we are enjoying coffee with or sharing life with. But still in the back of our mind we wonder, ‘what if?’ As a Christian, this is one reason I beg my brothers not to look at porn. Air brushed, pouty lipped women sans clothing have a way of hanging around in our memory rolodex. A beautiful godly woman can’t and shouldn’t ever have to compare. We dishonor women when we expect them to live up to fantasy standards, with or without porn involved. Men have to be deliberate about guarding our eyes. In those moments when the hot babe passes in front of our eyes, we have to take our thoughts captive. Fast. Hopefully before our eyes roll to the back of our head.
2. Men want to impress our friends. We may not go into public bathrooms with our buds. Or spend hours on the phone with one another. But we care what our friends think. Every guy at some point likes to imagine all his friends want his girl. Think, “Jessie’s Girl”. Only with cleaner lyrics. “Where can I find a woman like that? Like Jessie’s Girl?” Pathetic, yes. But it makes us feel more masculine if other men notice and admire the woman we are with. It’s an affirmation. Approval. Admiration. Call it what you will but we need it. If we are not looking to Christ for our affirmation, we leave room for a meaningless substitute. I’ve found the more time I spend in the Word and the more I get who God says I am, the more I am affirmed by the one who matters, and the less pre-occupied I am with what my friends think.
3. Men want to bear children with attractive women. Somehow we equate pretty and thin with healthy. Healthy wife, healthy offspring, healthy family. Long live the King! The unfortunate side of that is we often make fools of ourselves dating women much younger, still of child-bearing age even when we no longer want children, rather than seek commonalities with a godly woman our own age who is beautiful in her own way. The good side of that is, we seek a life long partner healthy enough to grow old with. Eventually, Lord willing, the adolescent driver grows up. He leaves the revolving door auto dealership. He commits to one vehicle. If he’s wise he will realize the more he invests in TLC & diligent maintenance, the greater his enjoyment of the ride even through the hills and valleys.
4. Men understand the science of gravity. We know that over time a woman who is a physical 9 will inevitably become an 8.2 even if she works at it. Because nature will invariably take its course. So we hold out for a 10, hoping to end up with a 9.3 after nature does its damage. While I’m on this point, we fear that once we are married a woman who looked to us like a 10 on our wedding day will stop working at her appearance after the honeymoon. Come on guys. Can I get an AMEN? Do you women honestly expect us not to notice when you stop wearing make-up, throw your hair up into a pony-tail, pack on the pounds cos you cancel your gym membership but wear sweats around the house day in, day out? I realize this is not exactly spiritual, just honest. But hang on. The spiritual application is coming. When a Christian man marries, he is committing for life. He willingly forsakes all others and faithfully commits his desires to one woman for the rest of his life. He hopes his beautiful bride will continue her efforts to be beautiful in part to help protect him from worldly temptations that are everywhere. I’m not blaming women whose men cheat. Just asking women to consider what it does to a VISUAL CREATURE when other women go to great lengths to look their best, even flaunt their goods while the woman he loves is indifferent to her appearance. And oblivious to her effect on him. REAL Christian men don’t expect Super Models greeting them at the door. Just someone who makes an effort to look good for us.
5. Men lack confidence. A big reason we test-drive is to build up confidence. I realize that sounds like a contradiction of the ego point I made earlier. But follow my logic. Men have a big enough ego we want to be with a gorgeous woman. But because we are generally the ones asking out the woman we take the brunt of rejection. We may test-drive an average looking model just to build up courage to take out a better looking one. Once accomplished, we feel empowered to continue to trade up. And up. And up. And so it goes. The bottom line is, every man fancies himself with a 10. Even if he has to start with a 6 & work his way up. But if looks are all we base our relationships on, the 10 will soon start to look like a 9 to us. And then an 8. And so it goes. We will never be satisfied. This is why Michael Lawrence’s questions are so important. ( Stop Test-Driving Your Girlfriend ) God has a completely different and a much healthier approach to choosing a mate than the old worn out scale of 1 to 10. By basing our relationships in Biblical principles we see women first as sisters in Jesus worthy of our respect. We hang out more in groups. We have fun with all kinds of women. Then we have multiple chances to build confidence with women in ways that don’t defraud or mislead them. Best of all, we discover the real 10, that godly, fruitful, spiritually beautiful woman Michael refers to in his article.
So there you have it. The raw truth about why men test-drive a relationship until they are sure no one ‘better’ is right around the corner. I’m sure there are other reasons, lame as they are. I’m not proud of these things. But I’m not alone in this. Which brings me to my final thought. If any man tells you that these 5 points don’t apply to him, he is lying. This is universal. For those of you in Rio Linda, as Rush would say, that means it applies to ALL men at some point in our life. If not all throughout our life. Some do a better job of taming the ‘what if’ notions. But we all come face to face with it sooner or later. Wise is the woman who takes this to heart and realizes that test-driving has nothing to do with her real, God-instilled beauty. Di has already covered that. If you missed it go back and read her Captivating blogs.
I’m done. You may commence hating me now. Or hopefully not. Hopefully, you will pray for me. And for my mixed up brothers who want to walk in the Spirit but as long as we live in the flesh we are prone to stupid fleshly behaviors. Including test-drives. But maybe, just maybe as all you spiritually beautiful, fruitful, godly women out there pray for us we will be less concerned about taking another spin around the block and more willing to drive off into the sunset with the one.
Livin4Jesus 
Men are afraid……afraid of true beauty…….which comes from their father wound……which is why they settle for a 6.1 rather than going after a real10……they don’t believe they can get a 10 nor do they deserve a 10….and what’s a 10? A women can have all the physical attributes and appear a 10 yet lack maturity, emotionally, spiritually, intellectually and that 10 goes to a 5 real quick. Men seem to want a trophy…..to hang on the wall, take down and play with then they want to play. Women want to be pursued by a real man. They may appear to want sex and many think that sex is the key to getting that man but after she gets him she wants to be loved not just sexed. So that’s want I think…….
JOHN BOY,
Regarding point #4–ARE YOU TRYING TO GET US KILLED? Dude, you don’t really expect us to say Amen, do you? I feel like a big enough jerk admitting I’ve been guilty of most everything else you wrote.
Nick
Nick, Your response is LOL hilarious! Thanks for the belly laugh.
Amen to all of it and thanks for putting it out there. I feel exposed but strangely relieved that I’ve not been the only jerk out there. More relieved that God forgives me and loves me in spite of myself. Now if I could just get my girlfriend to do that! So do I send flowers or do I grovel with an “i am a worm” speech?
Dale, Deliver the flowers yourself. That way you can give her the worm speech too.
Nah, Dale. Send flowers because you love her, but you don’t need to grovel. All you need is to get the little book, “For Women Only” and tell your girlfriend you’re going to read it before she does. She’ll want to know what you’re finding out about the vast majority of men, and then she’ll want to read it and find out what makes you tick. When I read it, I was relieved to find out that men are wired the way they are, and we shouldn’t feel guilty about that. The “sensitive male” period in recent history, which was in response to feminism, beat down a lot of men. When those men read that book, they will throw off those chains of shame that were put on them by our overly feminized society.
I would liked to have heard more about what women can do while the men we care for are holding on to us with one hand and still looking around for something better. It seems to me you’re saying even committed Christian men do this. And we’re what? Supposed to wait for them to grow up and just pray for them in the meantime?
Angie,
No Christian man who is “going steady” with a woman should still be looking around for someone “better”. If you realize that’s the case with the man you’re dating, drop him now and never look back. My opinion, now that I’m wiser from having dated the wrong way for a few years, is that you must only date safely. That is, no hand holding, kissing, etc…., any of which will inflame both parties’ passions and their emotions. Those nice endorphins come with a high price if either person is not committed. So, wait for that fun stuff (and make any guy you’re dating wait) until you both know you have found “the one”.
If your guy (and I’m assuming you’re not married to him) is looking around while holding you with one hand, drop his butt right now, and please do him the favor of telling him why. Maybe he’ll learn something, maybe not. But at least you’ll be free from the pain of uncertainty with that guy.
Right on, Angie girl!
Paul,
I agree that a woman with an ounce of self-respect would drop his butt as you say. I’ve had to do it 3 times and yeah I told them why. (2 of them actually seemed surprised I knew what was going on!) But I’m not so sure about the never look back part. What if she really loves the man and sees an otherwise decent man of God in him? What if he wises up and comes back and says he made a big mistake? Is there no room for forgiveness?
djridge,
Only if you’re married to him – then of course there’s room for forgiveness. Married people should try to stay together, provided they are both working at it. But if two people are simply dating, and not even engaged, there is no commitment yet. For that you should be glad, because you are doing the right thing when you end it. I applaud you that you have done this before. The guy has clearly shown that either a) he isn’t grown up enough yet to treat you right (better to find out now, instead of after you’re married) or b) he’s not as “into you” as you had hoped, and he doesn’t know how to articulate that (again, better to find out now).
Either way, he’s being juvenile. Hold out for a MAN. Don’t you want a man who regards you as more ideal for him than any woman on Earth? Don’t you want a guy who has dated enough people (in a safe way, so he’s not all confused because of premarital fooling around) that he is CONVINCED in his mind and heart that you are THE ONE? That’s what my fiancee got – a guy who completely believes that she is the best possible match for him anywhere in the world. I value her above all other women, and I’m committed to my part in making our relationship the best it can be.
I agree with what eHarmony founder Neil Clark Warren said in one of his books, that it’s a thousand times better to live single for the rest of your life than to marry the wrong person.
It looks like a lot of the blog concerns honesty. I wonder sometimes if people really are being honest but they just don’t know what they want themselves. I do think it’s a good idea to move on after 2 years if no marriage. I also wonder if these people are involved in premartial sex? That is another factor that depending on the situation can slow down the process, or artificially speed it up to a marriage that maybe shouldn’t happen.
Oooooh, Jerry. I just now noticed your “move on after 2 years if no marriage” comment… Really?
I’m representing the ladies. Not ALL ladies, but a LARGE percentage of us. Dear John, I never ceases to amaze me when I read – both Christian and secular articles – about how MEN are “visual creatures”. The articles are typically comparing and contrasting what’s important to a man vs. what’s important to a woman. Dare I speak the TRUTH? The TRUTH is that MOST women see men in EXACTLY the same light you see women! You heard me correctly…we see men the very SAME way for the very SAME reasons! And here is WHY it’s important that MEN finally “get that”…
Because men keep reading how women aren’t nearly as concerned about a man’s looks, (including grooming, hygiene, unhealthy weight, I could go on and on and on), as men are about a woman’s looks! That’s absolutely NOT true!
That sweats comment really got to me. While I have never worn sweats in my life (I think they are extremely UNflattering), almost without exception, every man I’ve ever dated has worn sweats at one time or another…some of them, often, until I took a hike. (Hey, if they wear them while we’re just dating, I don’t have to imagine much to know they’ll be wearing them after they marry!) Ditto, grooming and hygiene. Ladies, don’t wait til Summer to see that your boyfriends feet in sandals – it’s best to look EARLY on! What about fingernails you need to comment on to get him to cut them short enough? Hair that needs washed? Breath that needs freshened up? If he needs to shave twice a day, but only shaves ONCE on the weekend? – “because it’s the weekend”! My exhusband was in tip-top shape until after we married…talk about someone letting himself go… 30 lb. weight gain almost immediately, wanted to have sex without shaving or brushing his teeth, would wear sandals without trimming his toenails. YUCK! We even went to the Smalley Institute for marital counseling and he said, “If those MINOR things determine whether or not my wife wants to have marital relations with me, then I married the wrong woman.” I said, “If these things are truly MINOR in his book, then WHY did he NOT do them BEFORE we got married?” Though it took more than that to decide to divorce (which we eventually did) it DOES indicated that women fear the same changes in a MAN. In fact, I LOOK for those things to change early on in a relationship, knowing just how much they turn me off. Better to know sooner, rather than later.
John, women fantasize and have egos, too! Wake up and smell the coffee!
Finally, I think that often one of the biggest differences between the sexes is that women settle down quicker (mature) and realize that a fantasy is just that – A fantasy! Then they let it go. – while men continue to wonder “what if?” – which indicates a very immature person who cannot separate fantasy from reality.
Just don’t believe for a moment the common falacy that women don’t place a high importance on looks! That’s where you mess up, guys!
Kim,
Near the end of your post you said, “while men continue to wonder ‘what if?’ – which indicates a very immature person who cannot separate fantasy from reality.”
You are attempting to describe all men in general vs. the way all women in general are. According to your view, all men are immature. But that can’t be the way God created humankind – “women are mature, men are immature”. I have to point out that something is wrong with your perspective on men. I’m sorry that you have colored it that way based on experiences with your ex-husband.
Hi Paul. You’re right. I was in fact making a generalizations regarding both men and women and though I thought I had made that clear, obviously I didn’t. Sorry about that. At no time have I ever thought that ALL men are immature or that ALL women are mature. Not for a second. The point I was attempting to make was that John’s perspective (dare I say, “generalization”?) is in no way exclusive to men – that it’s shared equally by women, too. And, that by categorizing those characteristics exclusively to men – or, at least predominately to men – it sends a false message to men that women aren’t equally as concerned about looks. In a sort of perverse way, it’s actually a compliment to men! As in, you’re not alone in feeling this way, Guys! Of course, two wrongs don’t make it right, but if only men understood just how important looks, hygiene, grooming is to women…perhaps their marriages would be better and perhaps they would get more of the attention they are wanting from their wives. My personal belief is that if something is very important to one spouse, then it SHOULD BE addressed as very important to the marriage. And, yes, I agree that my experiences have colored the way that I see men. Have your experiences not colored yours, Paul? That’s applicable to good experiences, as well as bad.
There sure seems to be a lot of Pauls in this conversation so let me specifically direct my comments first to John and then to Paul Simpson who replied to djridge:
John, you are an interesting fellow and I appreciate your frankness. No sugar coating just the hard facts. I can only imagine what a counseling session with you would be like. Visions of the Geico commercial’s drill sergeant/therapist come to mind. I don’t agree with all you said but it does make a lot of sense and you were brave enough to personalize it which won you some credibility points. We get enough Christian-ese nonsense speak so thanks for giving us real life examples. Loved & Hated the image of your eyes rolling to the back of your head. I also appreciate your exhortation against porn. As rough as you are around the edges I sense that your heart is in the right place. Thanks for a great guest blog.
Paul Simpson, I’m glad your fiance got “a guy who completely believes that she is the best possible match for him anywhere in the world.” and that you “value her above all other women, and I’m committed to my part in making our relationship the best it can be.” But go easy on judging men who don’t know that yet. You didn’t come to that conslusion about your fiance overnight–you seem too smart for that. It isn’t necessary to tell us someone isn’t a real MAN just because he is confused about whether or not a woman is “the one” or because he just in’t that into the woman. That’s what dating is partly about, finding out what kind of person you’re really “into”. Anyway, I’m happy for your fiance. Good luck.
I’m the same person as Paul Simpson. I hope you’ll take what I said completely in the context of what djridge said before I replied to her. She said that 3 guys she was dating (at separate times, of course) had been looking around behind her back, and she caught them. That means they were being immature in their behavior. Anytime I dated someone who I considered to be a “girlfriend”, I was faithful to keep focused on her, on “us” only. Later, I dated a number of people for a season, telling each one up front that we needed to keep the dating safe, exploratory in nature, and non-exclusive. Emotional walls were kept up, but much information about personality was shared. I can’t imagine dating a woman in a way that makes her consider the relationship serious and exclusive, while exploring possibilities with other people. That’s not cool, not mature, simply not what a MAN does, if he follows Jesus. I commended her for dropping those guys because she was rightfully protecting her emotions. But it would be very risky to let one of those guys back into her life. Could she ever really trust him after that? Maybe I misread or misunderstood, but it seems she already knew that he didn’t view her as the best possible choice for him, otherwise he wouldn’t have been looking around elsewhere. In my opinion, she is too valuable to put up with that, and deserves a guy who will treat her with the love and respect that a grown up Christian man has for that special woman whom he longs to marry.
Hey Paul, You made an interesting point and I don’t know if you even realize it. You said, “Don’t you want a guy who has dated enough people (in a safe way, so he’s not all confused because of premarital fooling around) that he is CONVINCED in his mind and heart that you are THE ONE?”
The 3rd guy I ended it with for test-driving kept telling me how wonderful I am, that there’s no one else he’s met that treats him like I do or who comes close to my heart for God. He thought we were so right for one another but still he wanted to date others “just to be sure”. There’s been no fooling around so that’s not our confusion. I love this man and I see our Savior in him. I just don’t think he dated enough people in a safe way to be convinced yet that I am the one. He put himself through college then medical school, finished his residency all without dating. So now he’s established in his medical practice & he finds himself desiring a wife but not having enough dating experience to trust himself to make such a serious decision yet. I know he loves me. But he has those “what if” days that leave him feeling like a jerk for not knowing if I’m the one. He didn’t want to lose me but I broke it off to give him a chance to get it out of his system w/o feeling like a schmuck and to keep my sanity while he dates others. If he came back and said he’d prayed & reflected and now honestly believes I’m the one, I’d take him back. He was never malicious, just confused. I believe there IS room for forgiveness if two people really love one another and can positively answer those questions that Micheal posed at the end of his article.
I’m glad you cleared that up for us. What you and he are doing sounds like the best approach. He may indeed learn that you are the one, after meeting a few other women and learning what matters most to him in a potential mate. That’s awesome that you have the grace and strength to let him find out for himself. Your words, “get it out of his system”, while sounding like a virus that must run its course, are nonetheless the truth. He has to go through this. One day, you may both be together, and you’ll be so glad you did it this way.
Keep in mind that I’m no expert, just a guy who dated wrong, suffered for it, then read about dating in a sane, safe way. “Boundaries in Dating” and “How to Find a Date Worth Keeping” are excellent books by Dr. Henry Cloud and John Townsend. I can’t recommend them highly enough to anyone who is not yet married.
I loved the article…..test driving….and it is applicable for women too…….I believe we, girls and guys, should be looking for precisely that woman or man in their life…….
I have dated a woman for a little over 3 years in my church……and I did stay away from all single women in my church……..she and I met accidentally away from church, but in the end I believe God had us meet each other………as too whether we are meant for marriage that is the question. She is not ready and I can accept that and understand her reasons…..it would hurt to lose her, but love is not an ownership, but a willingness to serve….serve her. I have considered beauty fading too, yet I have found in body and heart…..the most beautiful woman I’ve ever known….her body could fade and my love would not……her internal attributes are so lovely………
John/Di,
I went back and reread the article by Lawrence and looked up the Scripture references. Then I read Wayne’s full comment and reread your comment. This has been such a god-thing. Thank you from the bottome of my heart.
My apologies to any woman who took offense to my remarks. I would never assert that women are not concerned about a man’s appearance. Or that men shouldn’t be equally vigilant in taking care of themselves. Especially when it comes to matters of hygiene and intimacy. Of course men and women both appreciate good looks and someone who takes care of themselves. But honestly not to the same degree. God did not wire men and women the same way. This is a Christian blog. I’ll try to keep it clean. Suffice it to say that a man can get turned on simply by seeing his wife walk into a room. Women don’t react the same way. It’s the difference between a light switch and an oven. Men are “on” in an instant. Women take time to heat up. This is what I mean when I write that men are VISUAL CREATURES. God wired us to notice beauty immediately and to respond to it. Whether we want to or not. That can get kinda embarrassing at times. I think you know what I mean. For years I’ve heard women complain that men are animals and all we ever think about is sex. Well that’s half right. We think of sex pretty much all the time. But that does not make us animals. It makes us men. It’s how God wired us. Thankfully God tempered our steady testosterone flow with a recognition and desire for true beauty. But we have to work on keeping things in balance. It isn’t always easy. And like Di said in her intro I don’t always get things right. Thanks Kim for speaking up for women. I’m sure there’s plenty of women out there madder at me than you are. You were just upset enough to write. I respect your input.
Thanks John. I’ve been trying to explain this to my girlfriend for months. We promised each other and God to keep our relationship pure but I’m a man and there are times just looking at her makes me wild. She’s beautiful. She gets so mad at me but I keep telling her I’m not doing anything on purpose except being purposeful about controlling myself when she drives me wild. I wish I’d get some credit for self control instead of a scolding for my natural reactions to her beauty.
djridge, I agree with what Paul wrote about your grace and strength in letting your guy go. I know that must have been very difficult for you. I also appreciate that you love him, see Christ in him and are posed to offer forgiveness if he “realizes he made a mistake”. I guess I would caution you about what the real mistake is though. His mistake is not that he couldn’t see you as “the one” or that he needed to date more. His mistake is the same one we have all made…thinking that any other human being could be “the one” for us.
I want to refer you back to the previous blog, the profound comments by my dear friend Wayne. “I’ve learned to live in the zone of ‘Seek first the Kingdom of God…’ and loving God with ‘all… all… all…and all.’ That shouldn’t leave much time or even space in my heart, soul, mind, or strength to want for anything else, let alone something I try to tell Him that He wants for me. Is it me, or is it Him? Can I really know if I started the clock with the caveat that He wants me to find ‘the one,’ or might I have been wooed into believing this by our culture… our modern Christian culture that says I get what I want, ESPECIALLY the opposite sex in the form of a Godly marriage, as long as I attribute this ‘want’ to God’s will.” WOW. He nailed it.
Wayne also wrote, “I am not alone, and I have found ‘The One,’ yet I still believe I will remarry… but it will have to be a woman who feels the same way, as I doubt I could fall in love with a woman who wants anything more than the love of Christ… from God Himself.” What Wayne is advocating is a “love affair with Christ, His Flesh and Blood, His word…” It’s what I’ve been blogging about in the postings prior to the Test-Driving blogs.
If the man you love comes to you realizing his true mistake was trying to find “the one” instead of resting fully in Christ as “the ONE”, if he wants to start anew with you both fully committed to a love affair with Jesus first , if you’ve both looked at the questions Michael Lawrence asked in his original article and can answer them in the affirmative, then I think you have the makings of something beautiful for the Kingdom. Even if the man you love never returns to you, continue to trust Jesus as “the One” to romance you and love you as only He can.
My heart goes out to you.
di
Di, your quotes from Wayne took my breath away! How I yearn to live like that on a constant basis! I’m new to your website. Please tell me how I can find Wayne’s blog. I want to read the entire thing, then clip it out and post it on my bathroom mirror! Thank you!
@ KIM, You better have a pretty big mirror. Last time I Googled his full name he had over 9,000 results! Wayne is a former atheist, millionaire hardcore business man turned passionate Christ follower, now a speaker & vocalist. His blog has much to say. Start with his personal conversion story and read on from there. But be prepared…he is up to his eyeballs deep in Jesus and you’ll need time to digest the wisdom that is God-breathed. Wayne doesn’t give opinions, he gives the Word. His blog is JesusDNA.com. You can also get to it by clicking on his name in my blog comment section.
Welcome to my site! Glad you’ve joined us!
Di
Without responding to every detail, ponder these questions.
Is each of your points also true for women? Are men really just visual? Is that true cross-culturally around the world? Or are we blaming God for our culture with it’s morals and values? Are we driven by sin in a fallen world?Are most Americans overweight because God made us that way – or is it driven by a society that celebrates and emphasizes food?
I am not a 10. Did God make me that way? Is beauty truly in the eye of the beholder?
Who is our Beholder? (God?) Is what we are doing or saying honoring Him in every way, every day? Isn’t honoring God in everything we do a cross-cultural phenomenon?
Beauty is in the eyes of the Creator and it’s evident to those who truly seek it.
When God created man, the Bible says “male & female created he them”. He also said the 2 shall become one. These were 2 very distinct beings with specific differences that when joined together, reflected the image of God as one. We must be careful not to insist that men and women are alike in every way. As tempting as that is in our current culture, the concept is unbiblical. The heart of a man is very different from the heart of a woman. God tells men in Ephesians 5:25-33 to LOVE their wives. In the same passage, God tells women to RESPECT their husbands. Why? Because love does not flow from the heart of a man as easily as it does a woman but it is what women need most. The same goes for women and respect which is what men need most. As humans we GIVE what WE want to RECEIVE. God knows this. It’s why He tells us to give what the other requires most. He is directing men to meet the deepest need of a woman’s heart—love. And He’s instructing women that a man’s heart desires respect and they must be purposeful in meeting that need. A popular book called Love & Respect hit the shelves years ago and is worth a read for a better grasp of this. My main point is that in all our efforts to equalize men & women we miss the beauty of the two becoming one. If men and women were exactly the same we wouldn’t need both genders.
One additional observation–we are comparing apples to oranges when we speak of being visually wired by God vs. our personal preference for people who practice good hygiene. These are not the same. In that regard, men and women ARE generally alike.
You made many excellent points, Nodrybones, and I followed you all the way until the your second (last) paragraph. I think I’m simply not understanding this male perspective – though I really want to! – so please don’t give up on trying to explain this to me.
You lose me with the “we are comparing apples to oranges when we speak of being visually wired by God vs. our personal preference for people who practice good hygiene. ” And for the sake of clarity (at least for me) I’d like to also go back to the original posting of John’s, where he used the “1 – 10” scale…
I’m assuming (and please correct me if THIS is where I’m “missing it”) that most any arbitrary woman would be rated very differently if she were well groomed and well dressed than she would be if she weren’t. Ditto for a man being “rated” by a woman. For example, once, at a large gathering of exclusively women, the discussion started out about how men frequently use the “1 -10 scale to rate women. After awhile, the talk turned to women asking other women to “rate them” and to rate themselves out of curiosity. One woman rated herself something like this: “On Saturday morning, when I’m chasing after the kids and cleaning the house, I’m a 4, in stained clothes, my hair pulled up in a ponytail, no makeup on, my polish chipped and in dire need of a shower. But, one night a month, which is reserved for date night with my husband, I’m a 9. My hair, makeup and clothes are perfect and I’m freshly showered and groomed. The rest of the time, I’m probably a 7.” Every woman in the room could relate! Those with a man in their life also commented on how excellent grooming made a real difference in the attention it garnered from those men. We also discussed how this applies not only to how women we see themselves, but also to how women see men.
So, when a it’s said that a man is “visually wired”, or “visual creatures”, or that a man is “holding out for a 10”, or at least holding out for the largest number he hopes he can get, or he likes to “mentally try on” the picture of himself with a “10” – rather than “settle” – I just don’t see the difference, unless the difference is that men get “stuck” in the FANTASY that the women they view to be “10’s” are “10’s” every moment of their lives. And to live in a constant fantasy seems to me to be quite immature. Believe me, WITHOUT good grooming, that “10” might be a “4”. No??? (I think this may be where I don’t get it. I welcome any and all explanations, as do many women out there wanting to better understand how a man thinks.)
After reading these blogs, I asked my brother and a couple male friends what they thought. Though all three said that, “John was right on target!”, that they felt he represented men quite accurately, when I asked them to rate themselves, 1. On Saturday morning after you’ve worked on the lawn or the car and haven’t yet showered or shaved. 2. At work on any given day. 3. On a special date. On all three, they stated the EXACT SAME NUMBER! (My brother did add, “A sweaty 7. An everyday 7. A dressed-up 7”.
I don’t think women “settle” anymore than men do. I just think we’re more realistic. As far as LOOKS ONLY go, we don’t expect the 9 husband we went out with last night will get out of bed in the morning looking like a 9. But, it would serve all men well to understand that we are, indeed, VISUAL CREATURES. If you’re hoping to woo your woman, it would certainly be in your best interest to aim high and understand that though YOU may rate yourself as a 7-7-7, women are rating you as a 5-7-9. If I were a man, I would want to KNOW this! (The things your wife wishes you understood, but is afraid to tell you for fear she might hurt your feelings – that LOOKS matter to her, too!)
I’m not arguing that men and women are alike. God made us very different, indeed. Women want to be loved. Men want to be respected. But, LOOKS mattering more to men than women? I don’t think so. I think men WANT to believe that women don’t think like men regarding looks. Let’s face it, women would prefer that men didn’t think that way either.
I’m not any more “proud” of this than John is. And, I’m not declaring it to be Godly. I’m simply saying it’s true. Just as John did.
Apples and oranges? Really?
DISCLAIMER: The above contains GENERALIZATIONS and STEROTYPING and in no way is meant to represent the opinion of anyone other than myself. Previous life experiences were involved in forming these opinions.
Kim, Girl go back and read your own words. I think you made the guys points for them. Men DONT rate the same way your GFs do. We see flesh and rank depending on how it’s proportioned. That aint gonna change even if she hadn’t showered. Our imaginations fill in the blanks. Even my buddy Andy in the next blog kissed his woman smellin’ like a smoke stack. We also SEE past the make up and lip gloss to how a gal carries herself. No disrespect to John’s comments but a gal could have no make up and hair in a pony tail and still be a physical 10 if she’s got it goin on in a pair of shorts and a low cut shirt. Thing is when a woman lets herself go so does her confidence and that’s what men notice. She dont carry herself the same, she hides what’s she’s got in sweats, she starts feeling dumpy and that’s what shows. Attitude follows close behind. The thing is, men gotta learn to love her and let her know she’s loved no matter what if they are comitted. Maybe then she’ll get her groove back and she’ll be a 10 again even with them extra pounds.
Hey Kim,
Here’s your break-down:
Apple= VISUAL CREATURE who is attracted to an image that appears to be female. The more feminine the features the greater the attraction.
Orange=VISUAL CREATURE who is picky and actually notices if the feminine image washed her hair and put on a clean shirt.
Like John said in his comment, our attraction meter goes off rather quickly whether we want it to or not when a woman we consider beatuiful passes by. And Jill, just so ya know, not every guy is going to see you the same. Some men think tall & athletic is a 10, some prefer short with some meat on her bones, some go for dark skin w/big dark eyes, and on and on. We all have this idea of what we think is beautiful outside and in. I bet there are men who would think you are a 10 if they spend time around you and you are willing to let yourself be beautiful to them.
Jeff J, you rock! I finally get it. Thank you! Your communication skills are awesome. Thank you for identifying what was confusing me.
Rowdy Robbie, thank you, too! Your definitions of Apple and Orange were not only clarifying, but gave me a good laugh to boot! I also thank you for addressing Jill’s comment, as I clearly understood every point she asked us to ponder and your comment helped to explain a couple of those points.
This has been an enlightening learning experience for me that I’ll share with many other women who desire to have a better understanding of men. (In general, of course!) Your efforts to educate are appreciated dear men!
One more comment for Jill’s very thought proviking question:
“Is that true cross-culturally around the world? Or are we blaming God for our culture with it’s morals and values?”
The reality of men being visual didn’t originate in American culture. In Bible times a woman had to cover herself from head to toe. She could not expose any part of her body to a man who was not her husband. Doing so was an offense that resulted in stoning. Even in many Arab cultures today, such covering is still the law. Women can be severely beaten for violating it. It was/is considered scandalous for a woman to TEMPT a man in such a manner as to dare show even a little flesh. Also, the Bible is full of examples of women adorning themselves to be presented to a man. An example: In Esther’s time women might be worked on by royal handlers for a year before they were taken to the king. The reality of men being VISUAL has been known through the ages. Our modern culture tries to deny this or water it down with the argument that women are visual too. In a previous comment to Kim I gave some suggestions how we know men and women are NOT the same in this regard.
This has been a very engaging experience. Thanks, Di for inviting me to be a part. Thanks, especially for not publishing my full name! John
John Boy, You are welcome to post here anytime. Your blog attracted more comments than anything I’ve ever written. Fortunately for you I’m in the process of crucifying my ego… di
John, your insights taking us back to Bible times are interesting in addressing some history of men being VISUAL CREATURES. Here’s a couple of scientific tidbits in laymens terms to help understand the WHY. The petro that drives sexual desire is testerone. Men have 10 times as much as women. That’s considerably more fuel to burn. Second, the part of the brain in the hypothalmus where sexual drive and attraction originate is 2 1/2 times larger in a male than a female brain. This helps explain why the average male thinks of sex every 90 seconds. Our brains have to fight to keep sex OFF our minds! So, concluding that men are much more visually wired by God than women is not at all a stretch.